Historically Accurate Costuming

[Lady LaSalle]

I thought that since we have so many new folks here now, that some of us "seasoned veterans" could share our tips/techniques for making Period Correct/Historically Accurate clothing. I know that there are a couple of folks here that make WONDERFUL PC clothing that put me to shame---but I'm trying and still learning! LOL!!!! So I've started this thread to show progress, research, finds, etc for a dress that I will be making shortly. I invite anyone else to just jump right on in, too, about past/current/future projects that they are making as well. Let's share the wealth of knowledge here on the Alley!:tban :ty :sewing


So my dress started with an eBay find (of course) for a discontinued pattern from the Wisconsin Historical Society (http://www.wisconsinhistory.org/patterns/index.html). The pattern (which is supposed to be a reproduction of an original pattern) is for an 1873 day dress which included bodice, overskirt, and underskirt. I began looking into fabrics that would be accurate to use, trying to be as true to the year/era that I could. I found that wide striped fabric seemed to be a necessity, and they liked lots of intricate rufflely decorations and lace for the dresses. I found a drapery weight silk red and plum wide striped fabric that fit the bill nicely, and matching red silk taffeta (courtesy of GG and Duzy) that will be used as trim. Going back to eBay, I found tiny handpainted glass victorian buttons that I will use to close the front of the bodice. They are hexagon shaped with red/purple/gold painted on them. The dress colors are rather dark, so to lighten it up a bit I decided that I would need some sort of ivory/cream lace. A brussels lace lappet with matching yardage was then acquired from Pieces of History (http://www.tias.com/stores/kayhless/). I am planning on using the lappet more like a collar for the dress, and the lace yardage will be for the sleeves. The "Beth" hat pattern from Denise Nadine ( http://www.denisenadinedesign.com/hat%20kits%20&%20patterns.htm) was then acquired and made. Now the pattern is dated 1881, but the same hat style was available in 1873. I already have period correct underpinnings, so I'm good to go there. I've decided to make my red silk ruffles have a tiny scalloped edge----about the width of a popcicle stick. That should slow me down making them suckers! You might not know this, but I have a thing about symetry and matchy-matchy. So if I'm putting ivory lace on the bodice, I have to put some ivory somewhere else as well. Yes, I'm OCD when it comes to stuff like this! After going thru a couple of my early LaModes, I found cool patterns for folding/pleating ribbon. So my teeny-tiny make your eyes cross popcicle stick scalloped edge ruffles will be headed with ivory pleated folded beaded have to sew this on by hand ribbon. Now to make matters worse, that parasol that I just posted on the eBay thread will be made to match this dress. I'll cover it in the red silk, line it with ivory silk, and do one of them cross your eyes ruffles and pleated folded ribbon on the end edge. Oh yeah, and I'm wearing black shoes! I'll post pictures of all my finds later this week.

[Allie Mo]

Oooh Aaah,

This is going to be exciting.

[Lady LaSalle]

Ok, research pictures! Here's one of a dress with the wide stripes that was popular, and the rufflely lacey trims.

[Lady LaSalle]

Here's my hat from Denise Nadine:

[Lady LaSalle]

And here is a hat from 1873:

[Lady LaSalle]

And here is kinda what the dress will look like:

[Drusilla]

LL, it looks like you are doing your research, and it's all very GOOD! And you are getting all the details set in your design, which is essential, especially the color scheme and what complements and enhances the whole picture. The underpinnings are there, so you are way ahead of those who would not think that is so important, IT IS, VERY important. I see so many nice dresses that lack the proper support, it's so sad, they look like deflated baloons instead of the beautiful picture that they deserve to be. So you are just cruising along and it looks and sounds wonderful, keep it up, keep inspired, don't be afraid to change your mind about details and give us lots of pictures!!:tban That hat is really pretty, especially all that shirring underneath.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

thats my poka dot dress you are messin with there missy...Oh like it will look anything like that when your done adding trim to the 9s....carry on!

[Lady Leigh]

This is going to be wonderful!!

The one thing I like about Wisconsin Historical patterns, is they give you a write-up about fabrics and colors used during the time period. Though fabrics are a tad difficult to find at times (not always), don't be afraid to look into drapery fabrics. Faile's, Bengalines, and etc are still used in draperys. Yes, sometimes makes a gown a tad heavy, but the bustle helps support the weight ...

By the way, LS! I love your new parasole! Totally awesome!!

[Victoria Rose Hyde]

Wow! How exciting. Anything Lady LaSalle makes, you know is going to be spectacular!!

[Lazy K]

Is it finished yet? Well, is it?:waiting :tap

When you do the foldy pleaty ribbon will you do a tutorial for us PLEASE:beg

[Lady Leigh]

Yah!!!! Were's the pictures? Huh? Huh? Geeze! The suspence you put us through! Really!!!!!!

[Ida Hands]

I NEVER KNOW what flowers to use. They confuse me in the store. I see some nice ones, but most are too big. How does one choose flowers for a hat?

[Bloomin']

What a wonderful project!! And if anyone can do it justice it is you, Lady LaSalle!

[Lady Fleur]

Lioness i have a local place for flowers... WE CAN PLAY!!

[Accurate Allie]

I NEVER KNOW what flowers to use. They confuse me in the store. I see some nice ones, but most are too big. How does one choose flowers for a hat?

Lioness i have a local place for flowers... WE CAN PLAY!!

I need help with that too! Hat decorating is something that I can't seem to become comfortable with, mine always come out too plain.

[Cat Cimmaron]

Lady LaSalle that's going to be lovely. Can't wait to see more photos. Great research.

[Prairie Wildflower]

LL, :ty so much for starting this thread. This is going to be so interesting! I've been acquiring some books of fashion plates (based on the recommendations of some of you dear ladies) and have been pouring over them, but I have to admit that I am somewhat confused as to which fabrics and prints were pc for which era. Since my personna is basically a homesteading/ranch lady, when she went into town or any town function, she would probably have made an outfit to wear in keeping with the current fashion, but not being as well-to-do as the cattle baron families, her pocketbook would dictate the fabric chosen. And that is also the way it is in real life, unfortunately. I have a stash of beautiful Victorian floral calicos (ok, I see :rolleyes: ), mind you, the better quality (and more pricey) heavier weight cotton that I think will make up into really pretty outfits. I have satin in various solid colors for the underskirts - the floral prints will be the overskirts, and I intend to use a combination of both for the bodices. To be honest, I can't always afford the silks, satins, brocades, etc., just as the lady I'm portraying probably would not have. Yes, I do search out the sales on those fabrics, and once in awhile I find a good deal. Albiet the better quality cotton calicos are now riveling the price of the nicer fabrics. I want to be as pc as possible while not bankrupting myself, so please, ladies, jump in with suggestions for keeping pc and staying within a reasonable budget at the same time (IS THAT POSSIBLE???):lool I've always worked with primarily cottons, and am a little timid about thinking outside the box and experimenting with other fabrics, textures, etc. Is this just me, or are there any other ladies out there with the same concerns?

Oh, and trims..........I LOVE lace, the more the better, but please let us know what trims were pc for which period. I'm really confused about the trimming, too - I've read that pretty much "anything goes" as far as trim back then, but, like I said, I really want to look as historically accurate as possible. So advice with trims,........pretty please. :ty everyone in advance for your always-helpful answers.

[Lady Fleur]

Aleeta yes i have gobs of stuff!!

[Lady Leigh]

[QUOTE=Prairie Wildflower;94059 To be honest, I can't always afford the silks, satins, brocades, etc., just as the lady I'm portraying probably would not have. Yes, I do search out the sales on those fabrics, and once in awhile I find a good deal. Albiet the better quality cotton calicos are now riveling the price of the nicer fabrics. I want to be as pc as possible while not bankrupting myself, so please, ladies, jump in with suggestions for keeping pc and staying within a reasonable budget at the same time (IS THAT POSSIBLE???):lool I've always worked with primarily cottons, and am a little timid about thinking outside the box and experimenting with other fabrics, textures, etc. Is this just me, or are there any other ladies out there with the same concerns? [/QUOTE]

In the 1880's Acetate was first invented, though not widely used until the 1920's (24, I think)! This was also called Poor Man's (womans) silk. However, this wonderful invention made it possible for lower incomes to create gowns with the look and feel of silk. In todays market, it is still very affordable and allows you to stay within a budget ... take advantage of it!

[Prairie Wildflower]

Neatshire, thanks for the info. Actually, I've seen the acetate, and will give it a try.

By the way, the pretty Victorian floral fabrics I'm referring to can be found at www.shabbyfabrics.com. Click on the "Mary Rose" collections, and you'll see what I mean - I think they are really pretty. I'm a sucker for pinky-rosey fabrics.

I'm in the middle of a NF outfit now, and will post "in progress" pics as soon as I can. I don't have a dress form, so it's kinda hard to get pictures of the outfit "under construction".

As I stated in my last post, trims have me REALLY confused. Which trims were specific to which era, or did they all sort of blend? I'm rather petite, so I try to avoid the bigger baubles, bangles, and beads, and go for a softer, lacey look (the incurable romantic in me loves the rosy print fabrics and lots of lace). Please ladies.............advice on pc trims :help :ty :ty

[Lady Fleur]

Pw silk is not a budget buster....
We can always procure some at 6-8$ a yard so it is GREAT!!
Depending on your needs let us know i can pre shop and send swatches then return for the goodies later!!

[Lazy K]

Check out Cheeptrims.com for good prices. And get on Fashion Fabric Club and Hancocks email list and watch for sales. I just bought some nice silk suiting at the fabric Club for $3 a yard. I stock up on fabric when I see it at a good price.

And about flowers for hats: I buy them when I see them at a price I like. I have a box full so when I need to decorate a hat, I just experiment with them. Things that seem too big or small may suprise you when you combine them.

Obviously, I'm not one to plan ahead like some. I buy first and have an "aha!" moment later when I see a plate or dress that fits.

[Lady Leigh]

Lace ... I try to stay away from shiny lace and concentrate on using Venice lace when I can. Cluny (sp?) is always a good one to use, crocheted lace is another. Organza and net lace are good historically correct ones to use. By net lace, I mean the kind that has embroidered flowers and etc on fine soft netting.

[Jolene]

Hi I thought you may find these links interesting

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Alonzo_House#Automatic_buttonhole_machine


http://www.sewmuse.co.uk/w&w.htm


http://www.ismacs.net/ww/button.html

[Ida Hands]

Thanks Jolene! Those are SUPER SITES! :tban

[Victoria Rose Hyde]

Oh Prairie Flower, I just love that Shabby Chic Website you posted. It has some beautiful material.:tban :tban

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

The silk Fluer is refering to is a dupioni...there is debate on if that is a PC fabric. Silk yes absolutly was the fabric of chioce for many dresses. The satin was a silk satin, organzia was silk it was very much in the mainstream.

However the weaves were much different than we can usually get today, a faille was very popular for instance, and the dresses I have seen have all had a different hand to them than we think of silk now, heavier and crisper...like a tffeta but heavier, and with less sheen to it sometimes than taffeta typically has.

I find that the cottons I like are also the quilting cottons, the problem is that out here at least a good quilting cotton is often 8-9$ a yard, and they never go on sale! We have one shop that has out of circulation bolts from last season quilting designers and everything in the shop is 5$ a yard, its also the stinkin cutiest little place you can imagine with super great owners. So when I am looking for cotton I like to try there.

Can you sew a great period dress in budget?...oh most certainly! Its all about timing, finding things on sale, collecting trims and fabric as you see them, and being patient for them to come together into a great ready to make design. This actually works because we tend to gravitate again and again to the same color families, and styles....you would be surprised how accurate your sense of color is if you are looking at your favorite hue. I dont hate calico! It makes really great underware! LOL ok ok ok ...teasing! My first and still favorite brown dress is a calico plaid cotton check, 3$ a yard....trimmed with a little cotton velvet, it has no over skirt, its a good sturdy brown dress period! I actually like the very plain day styles ( ask Beth I cringe at lace and baubbles!! Great on others very scary for me! ) I too think would be common in the average homes. I am just not sold they looked like LHOP in 1870-1875-1880-and 1885 thats all. If we are going to have a PC thread...well we are going to have to be able to discuss debatible topics! :chick :noe


Great sites...

Lace, yep I really like delicate venices and net lace is frankly my favorite...its soooooo vintage looking. If I can find cluny and crochet that is not too thik I always grab them, as they are great and seem to be less available.

The early bustle years had a LOT and I mean a LOT of what is called self trim, meaning that the trim consisted of the fabrics the dresses were made of, pleatings ruffles, bias strips all over the place, intresting ruchings, and foldy things tacked with stitches, you name it. Chantilly lace was still very popular and you see black instead of blond most often. It was very popular to construct a dress from one color in two tones, like a purple and a lavendar, dark green and light green ect. In that era you have a bit more in yardage, but with a good buy, you can go lightly with expensive trims and turn out an outstanding dress.

[Lady LaSalle]

Is it finished yet? Well, is it?:waiting :tap

When you do the foldy pleaty ribbon will you do a tutorial for us PLEASE:beg

Most definitely!

[Lady LaSalle]

After looking thru some of the books that we have, I found a couple of other fabrics mentioned. These are from 1870-1889:

silk (90% of all of the dress descriptions were of some type of silk----but no dupioni!)
camel's hair
silk gauze
nun's veiling (a thin, plain-woven, worsted fabric)
woolen goods
velvet
muslin, all different kinds
sateen
silk poplin
tarletan (a starched, open-weave fabric, much like cheese cloth)
satin
serge (a type of twill fabric that has diagonal lines or ridges on both sides, made with a two-up, two-down weave)
cashmere
percale
foulard (light silk fabric having a distinctive soft finish and a plain or simple twill weave)
leno (a light weave grenadine, see below)
crepe' de chine
grenadine (A thin, loosely woven fabric of silk, cotton, or synthetic fiber)
mohair
pongee (plain weave silk or cotton that has a heavier warp or filling yarn)
organdy
flannel
satin-faced jean (a light weight silk woven with satin)
velveteen
kerseymere (a coarse, twilled woolen cloth)
satinet (thin silk satin or imitation thereof )
cloth (I'm assuming that this would be heavy cotton)
plus many, many more!

Now some of these might seem like they are "colors" of fabric, but they aren't-----like grenadine.

These two websites are great for the names of more fabrics along with their definitions.

http://www.erinyes.org/spencer/fabric-def.html

http://www.fabrics.net/define.asp

[Lady LaSalle]

As far as trim goes, stay away from the nylon shiney lace if at all possible. Stick with the hand made look---kind of cotton---type for your day wear, and a more fancy venice lace for reception/evening wear. Now remember, lace was hand made as well as tassels and beaded trim. These ladies did some spectacular work! I actually found a hand made chenille-type applique in one of our books! Embroidery and decorative ribbon use seemed to be popular throughout the period. And let's not forget soutache! I have several ribbon folding patterns/ideas that I will share with you all when I get to that point in my dress making. They are pretty cool, with some being very simple while others are most definitely complicated. I think I'm going to shoot for a middle of the road style.

[Lady LaSalle]

Has anyone posted this link yet? I have bought fabric from them a few times, and it is truly spectacular! The best part about this website is that you can see a fabric style for the period of time you're looking for, then head off to your local fabric place and see if you can come up with something that may match it and cost less or is on sale.

www.reproductionfabrics.com


Another place to check out is this site. Phenomenal fabric selection here!

http://www.hancocks-paducah.com/

[Lady Fleur]

GG yes dupioni is cheap BUT i have found other silks and natural fibers at those prices!!
Sometimes i just have to bat my eyes:lool

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Oh I was not saying you cant find them...I have no trouble FINDING at all! I was just pointing out that the weave and slubbing of dupioni was not popular in the Bustle Era as it is now.

[Lady Leigh]

I buy from Reproductionfabrics.com often! Pricy, but REALLY good quality!! There has been a lot of research done before they actually sell any of the reproduction fabrics they have ... the color has been duplicated, too, which is wonderful if you are looking for a "Turkey Red" for example. They also sell reproduction fabrics for the Revolutionary War era, and I have recently purchased the line of Jane Austin prints for a quilt I am making. I recommend them very highly!

Like GG said in an earlier posting ... the best calicos to get at the moment are the quilting ones ... not just for the quality, but they seem to place better emphasis on the patterns used ... especially if you are wanting a reproduction print.

Here is a good link to the origin of lace ... a little helpful maybe.
http://www.taunton.com/threads/pages/t00138.asp

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Oh I got one for you sleuths out there....what exactly is the brown ploished lining you see in bustle ( and other era) dresses called?...probably just lining I guess. Anyway I know its some sort of cotton, thats been glazed...

Something else I have noticed that a herringbone twill seems to have had some popularity as bodice lining as well...they did not play around when it came to structure!

[Lady Fleur]

Yes gg it is a slubb issue.... i think it is a fight of man or machine LOL:lool :lool :lool I know that there is some debate over inferiority! But Yes Silk is avail. (easier to get for some of us than others that is why we "help":beg ) Because we love the alley AND its members!!

[Accurate Allie]

Oh I got one for you sleuths out there....what exactly is the brown ploished lining you see in bustle ( and other era) dresses called?...probably just lining I guess. Anyway I know its some sort of cotton, thats been glazed...

Something else I have noticed that a herringbone twill seems to have had some popularity as bodice lining as well...they did not play around when it came to structure!

My understanding is that it is cotton chinz (polished cotton) which is appearantly near impossible to find today in a form that does not become unpolished when washed. (the chemical that was originally used to make it was not so healthy, so it isn't used anymore, but the side affect is that the stuff that they make now you can't wash and keep the polish). At least that's the answer that I got from a costumer friend when I asked what chinz was.

[Prairie Wildflower]

Thank you, ladies, for all the wonderful advice on trims. I am partial to the cluny and venice laces, too. They look so vintage and so pretty and feminine.

Reproduction Fabrics is about an hour from me, and I LOVE going there and checking out the fabrics. If anyone wants anything from there, or wants me to check on anything for them, just let me know.

GG, I agree - the LHOTP (Little House on the Prairie) look was not all that pc. The homesteading families on the prairies, however, did wear calico most of the time, except for maybe their Sunday-going-to-meeting outfit, which might have been a silky fabric, or maybe just a fancier cotton calico. It is my humble opinion that the homesteading woman on the prairie would probably have shed her corset once in awhile, especially in the heat of the summer, when working in the gardens or doing chores. I know I would have :tban And I also venture a guess that she probably would've worn a pair of her husband's longjohns under her dress in the winter if the cold was too unbearable. Survival was key, and they did what they had to do to survive.

While we're on the subject, I have a question that's been on my mind for awhile. Were one-piece dresses pc, or is that another "Hollywood interpretation"? The Big 3 pattern companies (albiet they don't do many historically accurate patterns anyway) have a few patterns for "prairie-type" dresses, and they're all one-piece dresses. I have wondered, because I have a pattern from Past Patterns that I LOVE - the 1880's Day Dress. It's a one-piece dress, and I've made it a couple times. It goes together quick and easy, and is very comfortable to wear to shoots. You can make it plain in a cotton calico or make it in a fancier fabric if you want. Saundra Ros Altman, the owner of Past Patterns, is known for her research into authenticity, so I would tend to think it's ok, but I can't recall many of the fashion plates I've seen showing one-piece dresses.

GG and LL, thank you both so much - you are both such a wealth of information!!

[Lazy K]

Oh I got one for you sleuths out there....what exactly is the brown ploished lining you see in bustle ( and other era) dresses called?...probably just lining I guess. Anyway I know its some sort of cotton, thats been glazed...



Yes, I've always thought is was polished cotton and will bow to Accurate Annies knowledge.

I don't think I've got anything lined with twill. I'll have to take a closer look.

[Lady Leigh]

I have found many "one" peice gowns ... primarily with the Natural Form era, and again with ball gowns in the 1890's.

Sometimes ebay will sell what they call a One Piece Gown, but it is generally a Morning Wrap.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Lots and lots of princess line ( one piece) dresses in the natural form years like Diane mentioned, and being 1880 that would be about right. Done in a fancier fabric with some trims they were used for visiting ect. In simple cottons they were very popular wraps, house dresses.

I absolutly agree the moving west, and prairie life was probably calico country! I guess comming from a small town myself I tend to gravitate more towards small town wear, where there was more to be had in the way of social events, and possibly dry goods stores. I think at home on the farm women definatly went for comfort, and if they were remote enough to safetly go about their business with out fear of being visited un expectedly I am sure they shed much in the summer months especially. It was definatly all done, from ball gown to hard working wear... I am really glad that hollywood has made some real efforts over the years to try and show some range of womens clothing.

Remember Tombstone? The one wife wore one piece dresses through most of the movie, they are correct...and the other girls wore a range of styles...I think that is more typical for town ladies at least, simple stuff with some more public visit presentable wear here and there, depending on income.

[Drusilla]

Ok gals, and guys that might be interested, I want you all to get yourselves a copy of the "Calico Chronicle" by Betty J. Mills. This is "the" book to read for the scoop on what the pioneer women really wore.
Calico was in fact very expensive, .75 cents a YARD in 1830-1840 it was exported from America more than imported and most pioneer women wore linsey-woolsey, a sturdy fabric made from wool on the weft and linen from flax mixed with cotton on the warp. This was made at home on home looms. This was the staple fabric of pioneer women before the Civil War. If they were well off they might have one "good calico" or a silk dress brought with them when they migrated west. After the Civil War, the deprivation that accompanied wartime was past and the railroad was moving west, and it was no longer necessary for the women to spend time handweaving since yard goods became available at village mercantiles, sutleries or through mail order.
And they did use dupioni silk, it was called other things, like shantung. Dupioni as we call it today, is cultivated silk waste, of waste fibers that occur at the start of reeling (floss or frison, the short fibers on the outside of the cocoon) or at the end, and from damaged cocoons. Silk waste is used as staple fiber to give spun silk. The shortest waste silk is called noils and gives little bumps to the surface of the fabric called niole. Double cocoons cannot be reeled and give the slubby douppioni (dupion) silk that may also be used for "silk linen" called SHANTUNG. Historically speaking it was a cheaper silk used by the middle class and some examples I have seen were the "changable" silk dupionis. That as some of you already know is when the warp and weft are made from two different colors.
I have seen a few museum examples of dresses made from silk dupioni (shantung), not a lot of them survive, the thinner silk fabrics deteriorates and crumbles being a natural fiber. Usually the thicker silks survive better, like the failles and silk brocades and satins, Time-travelers sells a lot of these on ebay.
If Francis is reading this thread perhaps she can elaborate even more. I don't pretend to know everything, but this subject has come up many times before on different forums and I have done extensive research on dupioni silks and silk in general as a fabric used in the earlier centuries. I personally did not like dupioni until I discovered the awesome colors it comes in, and I started to do research into exactly how historically correct it is, and I would not have used it if it was not historically correct, and I have used it and will continue to use it for my bustle dresses. I did not like the slubbing but I got over it.:-)
And if you want to lose your minds over calicos that are historically correct go to www.zandsfabrics.com and click on the Baum Textile Mills fabrics that they have, and for those more budget minded go to www.periodfabric.com .

[Lazy K]

Thanks Drusilla. I think you do know everything.

Silk noile is one of my favorite fabrics. Besides being just an all around great fabric, I had heard that it's often made from the silk sweeping left on the mill floor and that somehow fascinates me. Recycling at it's best.

[Lady LaSalle]

Dru, that is really fascinating! All of the descriptions of shangtung that I have read talk about "rough silk or cotton". No mention of slubbing! LOL!!!! But now after reading what you posted, it makes total sense! Hmmm.....looks like I might be getting another book! :ty

[Allie Mo]

I knew this thread would be wonderful. :ty LL for starting it.

One of these days, I am sure you will get me to copy a fashion plate for another reception or ball gown. It's so nice to know where to come for help, if I decide to go authentic. :tban

[Ida Hands]

Thank you, Miss Dru! That was TOTALLY FASCINATING! :tban

[Cat Cimmaron]

I'd like to add my thanks to Drusilla also. I've read about the differences and the different silks before but never that detailed and so well explained. Very interesting and educational.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

and now I have learned something new today too...I can go take a nap! :gg

[Drusilla]

Yes, naps help me too, keeps my brain rested, you guys make me work too hard.:lool :lool :lool :rofl :rofl :rofl
Shucks thanks everyone.....I was hoping Francis would pipe in and verify, she's emdjumacated too.....
Fer goodness sakes HAVE FUN WITH THIS!!!!:wv
I cannot nearly express my great joy to see all of you making such beautiful PERIOD CORRECT dresses (not discounting those who don't, I'm just very happy about it!). No one understands more than me what a process it is to make these ensembles, you all make me proud to be an artist. In the beginning, there were very few of us, now there are many. It behooves you to become educated, so you can educate the ones who hopefully will come after you. This is how we keep history alive.;)

[Lady Leigh]

You know, Dru? I think I should make a trip from GJ Colo to Tombstone and sit down and visit with you over a cup of tea! You are absolutely facinating! Thank you!

Well, truth be told, I also learned something today! Subject .... Calico! I'm going to be buying a new book, too, La Salle!!! There will be a test on Monday!

[Drusilla]

Be happy to have you over for tea! Or lemonade or coffee or what ever.:-)
All anyone has to do is let me know when you will be here and I will mark my calandar. I will make every effort to be available.;) As Bob Barker used to say,
"COM'ON DOWN"!!!

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

I am totally going to take you up on that some day Dru...truly! You have met a tiny little friend of mine Josie and hubbie Wyatt Emp ( you have very similar red polinaise dresses) She assures me you are ten times more fun in person! There are just too many cool events in Tombstone not to go to them one of these days! :tban

[Lazy K]

Well, I bought the book yesterday AND I'm coming to see you next month! Yeah ME!!!:tban :tban :tban

[Lady Leigh]

I ordered my Calico Chronicle via Amazon.com

When are you going to be down in Tombstone Kazy K? During the Wyatt days?

[Lazy K]

When are you going to be down in Tombstone Kazy K? During the Wyatt days?

Yep, I told Drusilla I would help judge the costume contest.

[Drusilla]

Yep, I remember Josie and Wyatt, she's as cute as a bug ear, I really enjoyed talking with them.
Next month is Wyatt Earp Days, the 26th through the 28th, Sunday is the fashion contest. I have 12 events in May....:faint And we are still getting calls for more, but I have to turn them down, the group can only do so much.
I need three of me to keep up! I played Calamity Jane today, did a great stunt fall, the crowd just gasped when I hit the dirt, it was great fun on Allen Street, Cowboys getting shot, Earps shooting up the cowboys, and one very inbriated Calamity Jane getting thrown out of the saloon by the bouncer.:lool

[Drusilla]

Ok Someone, come up with a new question about Historically accurate costuming. What do YOU want to know, we have lots of information here and brains to pick!

[Lady Leigh]

Closures ... hook and eyes verses lacing. I generally see lacing on the back of gowns, but were hook and eyes used, too?

[Sweet Violet]

Saweet!! This thread is going to be a wonderful fount of information!! How fun! Now I need to find the time (what is that?) to read all the great info that you ladies have!! Thank you for sharing everything you have learned!!

[Lazy K]

Well, not so much a question but I've been researching the inside of skirt hems lately. You know, the dust ruffles and such. I'd like to hear all that you know .

[Drusilla]

The zipper was actually invented (1851) as a new form of "continuous hook and eye device".
From "The History of Underclothes" page 20 (another clothing refrence book to have on hand)....
"Hooks and eyes have seldom been used on undergarments. A rare example can be found on the inner surface of the turned-back collar of Pieter Brueghel's, The Old Shepherd, (painting), c. 1567. The collar would have stood up when fastened leaving the hooks and eyes concealed, as we see in the Sture shirts of 1567."

I know my great granny used the heck out of hooks and eyes on her clothes in the 1880's as I have some of them unused on their original cards and on the clothing she made.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

used the heck out of them...zippers?!?! or Hooks and eyes??

[Drusilla]

Most dresses from the 1800's had dust ruffles. Usually the method of application was buttons spaced at intervals and they were replaced when they could no longer be cleaned well. My prefered method is to whipstitch them in place, and I sew binding to the top of the ruffle for a strong anchor to stitch to. I ruche all of my dust ruffles. I always line my skirts and attach the binded edge to the liner with the whip stitch. Then when they get too soiled for the dry cleaner to get clean I just cut the ruffle off and make another. I make my dust ruffles just a tad longer (and slicker materials, like a silk/rayon mix) than the skirt so they take the brunt of the brushing of the streets and boardwalks. Tombstone has wooden boardwalks so I had to devise a hard core method of attaching the dust ruffles, anything else catches on the edge of the boardwalks when stepping on and off of them. This method just makes the underside smoother than buttoning them on like they did sometimes in the old days. And it helps when some clutzy guy steps on the back of your dress!!! :tap That way the stress is taken off of the fashion fabric and onto the liner only.
I also have made a "dust shield" for the train type dresses, short trains and long ones. That is an extra half moon of fabric fitted to the inside back lower section of the dress, basically the part that touches the ground and about six inches above. And that goes over the dust ruffle, and helps for a smoother movement over terrain. It just meets the edge of the dust ruffle, and be sure to turn the outside edge hem upward, remember it makes the movement smoother over the ground there should be nothing to catch nails in boardwalks or twigs and such. So from the ground up you have the dust sheild, the dust ruffle, then the lower edge of the skirt, ruched or plainly hemmed. This is also easily replaced or removed for cleaning. These two devices also give your skirts greater longevity because you never stain or wear out the bottom of the skirt.

[Drusilla]

Hooks and eyes GG... I will go back and clarify that...Zippers really did not come into great use until WWI. They had to be re-invented a few times until they were perfected.

[Gwen In LA]

Historically accurate hems...:help

What about the Hem Tapes I've seen on Civil War re-enactor's dresses? To my eye, some look like 'regular" fabric cut as bias binding, others look like twill tape folded over the hems. Seen both on silk and cotton dresses.

Is this authentic or just another reenactorism?

I've only seen a few authentic CW dresses (saw 5-6 yesterday, counting the little girls dress!) Haven't noticed the hems on authentic/antique later Victorian dresses. Trying now to squint at E-bay photos :)

Please edjumacate me :)

Dru, the dust shield info is so helpful, thank you!

Gwen in l.a.

[Drusilla]

Yes Gwen, hem tapes on the bias were a very basic way to protect hems. Dust ruffles require a huge amount of extra fabric, not everyone could afford deep dust ruffles and bias binding of the fashion fabric was a great and economical way to use up small scraps. "Horsehair" which is not really horse hair, but is a linen mixture heavy fabric was also used to stiffen hems on dresses and you may find that also on the undersides of hemlines. It really does help to examine all the antique hemlines on dresses, there are MANY ways to finish a dress, most were dictated by economy and expense.
The most expensive and decadant material I ever saw for dust ruffles was lace, yards and yards of handmade, ruched lace in layers on the underneath of very expensive indoor gowns, usually gowns made for balls and receptions or weddings.

[Gwen In LA]

Many thanks for the prompt and helpful reply...

I'm going to try horsehair on my next dress, probably hem tapes too :)

Almost had palpitations thinking of handmade lace as a dust ruffle!

Gwen in l.a.

[Lazy K]

Thanks Dru. I know Francis told us a while back about the balayeuses which sound like your dust shield.
Why do you line all your skirts? I'm addicted to cartidge pleats and my skirts tend to have lots of fabric in them which makes them fairly heavy. I use french seams to finish the inside. I have a few antique skirts and they aren't lined.

So, give me the benefits of lining.

[Lady LaSalle]

Ok, as promised: Pictures! Here is the fabric.

[Lady LaSalle]

And here is the brussels lace. The lappet is the top piece. The dark colors of the fabric really needed the lightness of the lace. It gets rid of the "heavy" feeling from the fabric both in weight and color.

[Lady LaSalle]

Here are the antique buttons that I found. They match perfectly! I have 18 of them, I do believe. Yes, I have lots of button hole making in my future!:faint

[Lady LaSalle]

Then a friend of mine, English Bev, gave me this reproduction necklace which also fits the time period for the dress. I like it! :tban

[Nellie Blue]

Beautiful choices!!! It's going to be AWESOME....as usual! :tban :tban :tban

You know English Bev? Isn't she a REALLY good shooter (with, of course, an English accent...hangs out with two guys...from NY)...I believe I've met her before....at Mule Camp 2005 & at Winter Range.

[Victoria Rose Hyde]

Oh LL. I love the lace and those buttons go perfectly with that material. I'm so excited to see the finished project. Can't wait to see the :ss :007

[Lady LaSalle]

[/QUOTE]You know English Bev? Isn't she a REALLY good shooter (with, of course, an English accent...hangs out with two guys...from NY)...I believe I've met her before....at Mule Camp 2005 & at Winter Range.[/QUOTE]


Yup, I know Bev and Flat Iron (her man) and Mike. They are wonderful people! My girls have really taken a shine to both of them just as we have. We are going to miss them terribly----she and Ed are moving to North Carolina.

[Accurate Allie]

I LOVE the lace you found, and I can't wait to see how this dress all comes together!

[Drusilla]

I like the material and the buttons and brussels lace is of course very pretty LL! I used some brussels on a dress of mine you can see on the Tombstone Vigilante website (www.tombstonevigilantes.com), it's navy blue and burgundy. I made my collar and cuff lace removable for hand washing, I did not think it should go through the dry cleaners. I put binding on the edge and used hooks and eyes like they did in Victorian times to attach them to the bodice.
About lining skirts, it really called flatlining and the purpose is to give support and body to the fashion fabric, and it also allows you to use the lining material to support other things like the dust ruffles and the netting you use to pouf out bustles underneath. Of course you should prewash all lining materials to prevent problems later from lining shrinkage, it keeps the fashion fabric and the lining the same tension. Lining also helps you put in proper plackets on the skirt openings. If you study how plackets are made, when you fold the one side down on the inside you whipstitch the edge to the liner, not the fashion fabric. This is part of what is called fine tailoring. A tailor would never make anything without flatlining it first, that is one of the first rules of fine sewing.
And yes my dresses often end up heavy, but the methods I use are the methods they used, when they (in the 1880's) could afford all the extras that make a gown that was real clothing, to be used for a long time and passed down. All of my bodices are flatlined AND lined, and boned. The antique dresses you see on ebay that are in such good condition because they have liners and support, helping the outside fabric survive.
That is why I bought a Baby Loc Denim Pro, because it is for sewing many thick layers of denim. And I do not live in a high humidity area, it's hot here, but it's a DRY hot so more layers is not a big deal.

[Prairie Wildflower]

LL - I love the way the lace, buttons, and necklace make it all come together. Can't wait to see the finished creation!

Dru, thank you so much for your wealth of information. I ordered a copy of "The Calico Chronicle" and can't wait to read it.

And thanks to everyone for raising questions about historical authenticity. I am facinated with the historical facts and accuracy of the Victorian Era in general, and costuming in particular. My problem is........never enough time to do the amount of researching I'd like to do. The nice thing is that, homeschooling my daughter, I can incorporate this research into a class project. We're big into "unit studies", and I'm now planning a unit study with her on "historically accurate clothing of the Victorian Era". That way, we're both learning about it, and can use our lesson time for the research. You're soooooooo right, Dru - we need to be educated ourselves, so we can pass this information along, to preserve it for future generations, because, sad to say, a lot of our younger generation doesn't seem to have a love of history or desire to preserve its authenticity. It's up to us to "light a spark" in their hearts (and eyes) for how beautiful the Victorian Era (as well as other eras of history) was. Keep up the good work, Dru!!

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

Yup, I know Bev and Flat Iron (her man) and Mike. They are wonderful people! My girls have really taken a shine to both of them just as we have. We are going to miss them terribly----she and Ed are moving to North Carolina.

Yea for us!!!! Sorry for you, but YEA for us!!!:tban :tban :tban

[Lazy K]

Thanks Drusilla. Very interesting. And I've always wondered how they took the cuffs off for laundring.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

ahhh ok not zippers...I thought I had lost my mind for just a second there.

Very good loking goods there Beth ( I hate that fabric though...horrid stuff to match if ever there was! That purple is the most unique non matching shade on the planet I am sure!...so we matched the red instead)

Everything is really intersting and I am enjoying this thread...but as I drove a needle through my fingernail all the way through the finger and snapped off a needle at the hilt:faint ...I am getting apost shock pounding headache that is screaming for me to get away from the screen and take some advil.

I am ok before you all start freaking out. I really do think I had some mild shock...I went numb and didnt feel the wound...I started shaking about 30 minutes later, I still dont feel the wound... I went and got a shot of antibiotics after Matt got home just in case the Dr seem to think it was worth it not to chance an infection....

The good news is I menaged not to bleed on anything.:lalala

[Allie Mo]

GG,

Pleeeease be careful! I've been there and done that (first day of sewing class in 196x. Ouch!

Hope you feel better soon!

[Lady LaSalle]

[QUOTE=The good news is I menaged not to bleed on anything.:lalala[/QUOTE]


Are you ok? Was it just a regular needle or the sewing machine needle? Oh gawd! Holy crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:faint Put some ice on that sucker, and have a drink of something stronger than Coke. Then go to bed! Oh man, are you going to feel that in the morning!

[Nellie Blue]

...but as I drove a needle through my fingernail all the way through the finger and snapped off a needle at the hilt:faint ...I am getting apost shock pounding headache that is screaming for me to get away from the screen and take some advil. ........

...The good news is I menaged not to bleed on anything.:lalala

See another one of those...."Now quit thinking about going to LA...I mean it!" moments!!

I'm so proud of you saving the fabric from the blood! :scared

Girl, you'd better be more careful!!! Keep the fingers out of the moving parts!!! :faint

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

Holy Smoke, GG, you aren't supposed to sew thru the appendages. :scared :eek: :scared :eek:

I sure hope you are okay.

[Sarah Bernhardt]

Oh my gosh GG, what a horrible thing to happen. I got the shivers just reading about it what happened to you. I hope that you are okay and will be feeling better real soon.

[Ida Hands]

I am just overwhelmed by all the information being gathered! THANKS!!

[Drusilla]

No one can say GG doesn't dedicate herself to her work.....ouch! Ice , ibuprophin and elevation. Thankfully I have not done that one yet, but I did put an ice pick through my hand once..made an interesting scar.
Most bad wounds you will not feel, I got hit in the knee with an ax and I thought it just glanced off, till I saw the blood, then I knew I was in trouble, stitches!!
And NO GG is NOT a klutz, just really active....;-)
That's what they tell me!
Oh, and GG have you had a tetanus shot lately?

[Drusilla]

OK , someone ask another question so we can get GG's mind off her accident.

[Nellie Blue]

OK , someone ask another question so we can get GG's mind off her accident.

Okey dokey!

Well, you know I'm just about as anti-period correct as can be....and certainly not politically correct..."ignore them they will go away"....but I have a question.

How the heck did they keep those thigh high stockings up?!!! I had the modern type and I couldn't keep them up!

[Nevada Skye]

I wore a pair to those supposed to stick to your thighs stocking once, when we got real dressed up to go see the play "Phantom of the Opera" in LA. Well, we are walking along, and down they slid to my ankles!!! I slipped behind a parked bus off the sidewalk to pull them back, glanced up to find the bus was not empty, lots of interested people looking down........:go

[Nevada Skye]

GG, I hope your poor finger is better now! I had a student who made costumes for the Follies here, and she ran a needle through her thumb once. And you wonder why I get so tense when I sew???? At least my paint brush won't attack me!!!!

[Drusilla]

Yea, but Skye, it's that turpentine you best look out for, it can be vicious!:lool
Ok good stocking question Nellie. Stockings were held up with garters suspended from the bottom of a ladies corset. If you may notice on corsets like Axfords and Vollers (commercial brands from England) there are two tabs on the bottom edges of the front and back of each side. These tabs are for the hooks that hold garters to the corset. The bottom ends of the garters then attach to the tops, front and back, of the stockings which were thigh high. Garters are like little suspenders, and they have adjustment slides on them to adjust the tension.
Most commercial corset sellers include a set of garters with the corset when you buy them, but I like to find my own, the garters they send tend to be kind of flimsey and I prefer the wider kind as they are sturdier and more comfortable.
I'd show you a picture, but my thighs are not for family viewing..................:-O

[Lazy K]

Drusilla, could you please, please, PLEASE :beg :beg :beg turn one of your dresses inside out and show us some of the things we've been talking about? I've seen instructions on making a dust ruffle but have never actually seen a picture of one. And I would love to see exactly how you use attach the cuffs with hooks and eyes.

And you said that you flatline AND line the bodice. Does it look like modern day lining (no seams showing) when you are finished?

[Lazy K]

Oh, look. A dust ruffle. Am I right?

[Ima Schofield]

BIRTHDAY IN SEPTEMBER, MOTHERS DAY HERE SOONER...

GYPSY GETS GLOVES :lool


Ima, hiding from the "fall out", Schofield

[Madame Olive Yew]

Thank you ladies for all the great information.

I have a question, Got any suggestions for HUMID & HOT historically correct dresses? Layers are the ememy!

Thanks in advance.


LL ~ Love the acquisitions. I look forward to watching this gown get made.

[Madame Olive Yew]

IMA!:lool :lool :lool



GG ~ I hope you're feelin better! Lordy, almost made me sick when I read about it.

[Black Box Belle]

So with all this wealth of information I am just baffeled.....wow.....my head is spinning!!!!!:faint

But I am curious....did any of the women use material from an old skirt or dress to make a new outfit????

[Drusilla]

Yes, definitely a dust ruffle, but probably that is a mostly indoor dress. And you can see the horsehair liner used to stiffen the bottom of the dress, that's the white liner that looks coarse.
The only thing I know about wearing layers is use 100% cotton, always powder yourself under your chemise before you corset, go with a minimum of petticoats and don't run any track meets or go sunbathing in costume if you can help it. In other words shade and a breeze are the place to be. Oh and don't forget your hand fan or parasol, ever. They are lifesavers. Oh and I forgot, a wet/dampened hankie is a useful tool for cooling your exposed skin on your face and neck.

[Drusilla]

Ok Belle, to anwer your question....
When a dress was recycled, it was either handed down to servants or children, or younger sisters, which was very common even amongst the very rich, sometimes a tuck or dart here and there would do. Sometimes they completely dissasembled the dress or skirt and remade another out of the material, and the latest style was made from a previous style. That happened to quite a few civil war gowns. In some of my best fashion books there are photographs of remade dresses you can see the old seamlines and stitch marks on the "new" dress, and that is how they identified the age of the material as actually older than the fashion displayed currently by the dress.

[Drusilla]

I am sorry Lazy K, you may have to wait until you get here to see the undersides of my dresses. I am swamped now with work and I am in the process of finishing my Mom's estate, selling her house and buying and moving myself, my husband and the animals to a different home. I will try to set some time aside to do some pictures in the morning. I am actually getting sick of the sight and smell of packing boxes and tape.......:faint And just mention the word "realtor" and I want to run away screaming.......You might notice from my posts that my computer time is either really early in the morning or late in the evening. The days are all filled up.:help This year has been just crazy so far, actually insane is more like it.....and it is not likely to let up for many months. The only normalcy in my life is my job in Tombstone directing and performing and talking to you folks here. Tim and I have been looking for a new home for over two years, and we finally found one just ten minutes away. But the deal is still in the works and we have a ways before closing. We have been on our ranch for 25 years, so this is a big change for us, the kids are grown and out of the nest and we are downsizing
and moving to a really neat house and property on the mountain here. So please understand if I do not get back here to the forum as often as I used to.

[Lazy K]

OK, but If you feel someone sneaking up behind you and lifting up your skirts it will be me :rofl :rofl

Best of luck on the new house! I'll keep my fingers crossed.

[Kid Sopris]

OK, but If you feel someone sneaking up behind you and lifting up your skirts it will be me :rofl :rofl

Best of luck on the new house! I'll keep my fingers crossed.

If'n I was you, I let her know I was there doin it. Y'all see that walkin stick she has? Well on the end is a crystal door knob handle. It serves two purposes!:tap
(1) for comfort, (2) to unlock the brain cavity of those who startle her or don't behave properly!:lool :rofl :lool

[Bloomin']

Before Lazy K gets into trouble :lool here's what I found in Tornado Alli's peach/ivory gown. I'm sure she wouldn't mind me sharing this because it is such an extraordinary piece of work. This is the overskirt with train and almost 2 feet of the train will drag on the floor.

17867

[Bloomin']

Inside the train is a muslin liner that buttons to the train on all sides with grosgrain ribbons at the top corners. The buttons are sewn onto the train fabric and the buttonholes are made in the liner. The entire liner can be removed and the muslin and its three layers of lace can be washed.

17868

17869

[Drusilla]

He's right LK, dang it Kid, now you have given my defenses away. You seeeee LK, there are a few stupid cowboys who have attempted to lift my skirts.....they have been properly disciplined with my staff. I used my reticule once and bent my sliver purse/hand mirror.....decided I needed something that would leave more of an impression.:w2 And yes I have used a few hatpins, we call them "husband tamers" here, but I really don't like cleaning the blood off of them.....

[Drusilla]

YES!! A PERFECT example of just what I described before...:ty :ty :ty ...and still so nice and clean! Thanks Bloomin....Ok folks I have to leave for the day to go negotiate with realtors and see a man about building a fence, I'll be back tonight to catch up here. Everyone have a wonderful day!:go

[Lazy K]

Thanks, Ms. Yankee. That's just what I wanted.:ty

[Prairie Wildflower]

Thanks, Bloomin' for the photos of Alli's gown. It is sooooooo beautiful. And how ingenious. My pea brain never would've thought of doing that. I know that when I did Civil War reenacting, a lot of us ladies would take scrap pieces of fabric, 2-4 inches wide, and sew them on the undersides of our day dresses - the camp sites for reenactments are notorious for always being either dusty or muddy. But I love the idea of the buttons to make the dust ruffle removeable for laundering. So simple.

A continued :ty to everyone for contributing both questions and answers to this thread. Very interesting and informative. Keep it going, ladies - I want to learn all I can.

[Bloomin']

Thanks, Ms. Yankee. That's just what I wanted.:ty

Well, silly me, in a week and a half you can see it in person!!!

[Lazy K]

Well, silly me, in a week and a half you can see it in person!!!

I'm counting the days!:tban :tban :tban

[Victoria Rose Hyde]

Wow. What an exciting web. Loved the information regarding the underskirts.:ty Dru

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

I attach my dust ruffles the same way as Alli attaches hers. (Imagine that....you know we share tips.) You can also use a dark lace when you have a fabric would not look right if it had a cream/ivory or white lace showing from under the train. Plus, the dark lace shows dirt less. :tban This is the dust ruffle I have in the peacock dress. Sorry, I don't have a photo of the complete dust ruffle, but here it is during actual wear.

I forgot my dust ruffle for the tan & aqua dress when I went to St. Louis and I'll be darned if the train didn't get snagged on something and now I have a small tear I need to repair. UGH. Dust ruffles not only keep your train clean, they decrease the wear and tear from dragging around on the ground/floor.

[Ida Hands]

THANKS LADIES! That is a whole LOAD of information I REALLY NEED right now. (LA Ladies understand) Great information about dust ruffles. :ty :ty :ty

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

And you wonder why I get so tense when I sew???? At least my paint brush won't attack me!!!!

bahahahah ok that made me laugh!!! Thank you Nevada!! Hey I just mailed out the last corset order waiting to go...KATE that means YOU! I am officially corsetless sewingless at the moment...so hows that fitting mock going?? :gg

Actually I am so glad to have a free table for the next week to finish the 5 dogs stuff...Holy Cow do you think they would re-schedule it for ohhhhh 6 months for me? No? Ah well better stay at it then!

Ok the finger in incredibly good...Julie was here last night doing panic undergarment sewing so she dont have to go to her black powder shoot this weekend with a bare bottom (yep...you hang out with me I just might tattle on your undie status! LOL!) Anyway she like me was inpressed its not too bad at all...just a nice definate hole...but still not serious pain, so I managed to hit the 1 in a million spot I figure either that or I need to reconsider my childhood dream of traveling with the circus ( Although I thought being a pretty girl riding elephants would be more for me than hanging suspended from hooks through the flesh ...but who knew?!?!) Julie tells me I missed my chance because I didnt go buy a lotto ticket right away! LOL!

Catching up on this wonderful thread...Detoxing ofter state standarized testing ( wanna ask me how much I WONT be doing this next year!?) and I am off again to the shop! I am still going to be incredably scarce untill Monday the 7th. I am trying to keep up with everyone, but I know you all understand and all.

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

I am officially corsetless sewingless at the moment...so hows that fitting mock going?? :gg

I mailed the mock up back this week after I sent you the pictures.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

LMAO!!! Fannie that was not a request for more work:lalala :gg ...I was just ribbing Nevada! LOL

Ok I will be looking for it in a few days...We will hit the ground running after the 7th and I think we are good...The next one will be in living color!! :ty

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

LMAO!!! Fannie that was not a request for more work:lalala :gg ...I was just ribbing Nevada! LOL

How was I supposed to know you weren't talking to me? Silly girl, I am one of those people that have a guilty conscience over nothing. So, when you asked about the mock, I thought, "Dang, she hasn't gotten it yet, better let her know I ACTUALLY did mail it.:lool :lool

[Drusilla]

OK....Time for another Historical Costuming question...don't be bashfull!! Let's keep this thread rolling!:tban

[Gwen In LA]

Have a question about buttons...the black hard rubber/ gutta percha buttons.

Have been thinking about purchasing some repros. The antiques I would remove.

Do I have to take them off of a cotton garment before laundering in a home machine?

:)

Gwen the lazy laundress

[Lady Fleur]

Gwen always error on the side of caution!!

[Drusilla]

Yes, I concur, it is always safer not to risk the buttons and make them removable for cleaning. The military has a neat trick, they use metal buttons with a long metal shank with a good sized loop on the end of it, this loop has a small cotter pin inserted into it to stabalize and attach the button to the coat after it is inserted through a small button hole through the coat front.
When cleaning was necessary, they just romoved the cotter pin and off came the button. I get my itty bitty cotter pins at the hardware store.:-)

[Lady Leigh]

Fabric color question ... In the 1880's heliotrope was a popular color, but what color is it??

Another popular color was invisible green ... what does that look like (and no jokes, I'm serious hehe)

[Madame Olive Yew]

This is what I found:

Heliotrope (color)

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Jump to: navigation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heliotrope_(color)#column-one), search (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heliotrope_(color)#searchInput)

[/URL]
Heliotrope is a pink-purple [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hue"]hue (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_colors#Hex_triplet), similar to the color (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color) of the flower heliotrope (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heliotropium).
The color heliotrope would be equivalent to a pure chromatic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chroma) purple (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purple) that would be midway on the color wheel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_wheel) between violet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violet_%28color%29) and magenta (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magenta).
This color has zero (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/0_%28number%29) yellow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow) reflectance so it can be seen as the complement (opposite color) of yellow.


Heliotrope is a vivid shade of lavender
This color is a very bright version of what many think of as lavender (when the term "lavender" is used as a general color term), just as the color indicated as "lavender" on the chart below is an extremely pale grayish shade of lavender. See article on the color lavender (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavender_%28color%29) for the distinctions between various shades of lavender.

+++++++++++++++++++++++

About the PLANT:


About the Heliotrope - Marine : The Heliotropium Marine, 'Heliotropium arborescens', produces purple flowers that smell of fresh vanilla. They are quick to bloom and have a very compact habit. Plant the Atlantis in full sun or light shade in fertile and well drained soil. This plant is a great choice for mixed planters with its rich foliage and purple flower clusters. The Heliotropium plant is often called Heliotrope and is great for attracting Butterflies. In warmer zones this plant can also be a perennial.

[Madame Olive Yew]

Invisible green is defined:

a very dark shade of green, approaching to black, and liable to be mistaken for it.


Sorry I couldnt find a color sample.

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

This blouse is described as "heliotrope".
http://www.corsetsandcrinolines.com/timelinepix/1910/heliotrope1.jpg

[Lady Leigh]

Awesome!! Thanks, Ladies!!! I think I have the Heliotrope color of fabric in my stash! I'm going to have to take a look!

[Drusilla]

Ohhhhh pretty color! I made a magenta/turquoise dress last year, it still needs an over skirt...seems a few others caught on to the magenta craze too. But this heliotrope is more of a deeper, purply color..nice! Here's some pics, I was sqinting terribly, bright morning sunlight ya know...
In the old days they used to corodinate color with hair color and skin type for the best effect, now we do "color charts" for individuals.

[Madame Olive Yew]

Ohh pretty Miz Dru!! :tban

[Victoria Rose Hyde]

DRU, That outfit is just amazing. :faint Love the detail around the neck and sleeves. What patterns did you use? :tban :tban

[Cat Cimmaron]

Yes, pattern numbers please for the amazing dress. Thank you Dru.

[Dixie McCan]

Dru, those colors are amazing together! You look wonderful, and I want to know also, what patterns did you use??, please & thank you!

[Drusilla]

TV 261 for the skirt, soon to have an over skirt added, and TV 460 with a modified neckline. Rasberry silk dupioni with a turquoise cross thread and turquoise dupioni. That rasberry is very difficult to find, I made the mistake of not buying enough and had to wait and hunt for more as this was a discontinued fabric to make a matching parasol and overskirt both of which are almost done. When I get it done I will post it, not soon though, still working on family, moving and job issues too much to sit down for long.:chick

[Dixie McCan]

Thank You Dru! I went over to TV and looked at both your patterns.

[Victoria Rose Hyde]

Well its just stunning on you. I'm off to TV :ty :go

[Madame Olive Yew]

What do you use to flatline silk with?

My silk is medium weight home dec kind. I'm making an altered tea gown & wondering what to flatline/line the gown with.

Also do I need to flat line the entire dress or just the bodice portion? My dress will be along the lines of an evening gown or reception gown with full sweeping train.


BTW thank you for talking about dust ruffles & such. I plan on adding that to this gown.


Thank you in advance

[Lady Fleur]

Twill 4 bodice..
skirt depends on the drape.. you might not need it??

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

What do you use to flatline silk with?

My silk is medium weight home dec kind. I'm making an altered tea gown & wondering what to flatline/line the gown with.

Also do I need to flat line the entire dress or just the bodice portion? My dress will be along the lines of an evening gown or reception gown with full sweeping train.


BTW thank you for talking about dust ruffles & such. I plan on adding that to this gown.


Thank you in advance

Go to this thread and scroll down, we are talking about lining over there:

http://www.carolinabelles.net/vb/showthread.php?t=6245&page=3

[Madame Olive Yew]

thanks ladies.........:go to that thread

[Prairie Wildflower]

Dru, that outfit looks gorgeous - I never would've thought of combining the raspberry and turquoise, but they look great together.

I have a question: you mentioned making a matching parasol. Ok, how does one go about making a parasol? I have a couple of the lace parasols that I purchased from Wild West Mercantile - one in white and one in ivory - that I use most of the time. But they are getting a little soiled from all the dust at the shoots (how do you clean them, by the way??) and I don't want to ruin them, so I'd like to make some parasols that match my outfits. Could you please give detailed directions for making one? Thanks so much, Dru - you certainly are a wealth of information, and I am enjoying this thread immensely.

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

PW, this is the parasol patterns that I have:

http://www.shootingstarhistory.com/classtexts.html

[Allie Mo]

Prairie Wildflower,

Butterick has a pattern too. Sometimes Hancock has $0.99 pattern sales.

[Dixie McCan]

Yup, I saw the parasol pattern in Butterick's over the last week -

[Drusilla]

Most of the parasols I restore I get with the old material remnants on them and I use these as a pattern. I carefully snip or with a ripper take one full panel off and make a paper pattern with that panel, add 1/4 inch for sewing and reproduce the panels and sew them together. Usually I will line the panels with a contrasting or matching color for strength, but it is not totally necessary. When you sew the edges together, do the french seam, which encloses the raw edges. Leave enough of the area on the top where the points come together to insert the top top point of the parasol. Hem and decorate the bottom edges, make a small, gathered ruffle to sew onto the top. Then you sew the top on and sew small regular spots to the spines of the parasol. Shooting Star does have the best pattern and explanation, I also highly recommend them as they will explain perhaps better than I can the process. I often also restore the handles and the tips as they tend to get pounded into the ground, copper tubing used on swamp coolers makes good tips if the tip is gone, but you have to have the tools to cut lengths and file them smoothly down. And I also repaint them with Rustoleum on the spines after steel wooling them smooth or sandblasting them clean.
I restore and clean my parasols with a 50/50 solution of water and oxyclean in a spray bottle. I hang them upside down on the clothesline outside, (open) and wet the parasol first with water then gently spray the solution all over the inside of the parasol, until it is soaked completely. If it is really soiled with rust stains it may take more than one application, but let it dry and rinse with cold water from the hose. The silks and satins DO NOT take this as well as the linen or cotton and you might go easy on the oxyclean solution at first just to test it. Many of the earlier dyes they used cannot take the oxyclean and it will bleach them out as they were organic in nature.

[Drusilla]

Yes, as Fleur said, twill flatline on the bodice ( I also use a nice matching silk or cotton, on the inside as a liner, so there are actually three layers to my bodices ) and I use a high quality cotton to flatline the skirts, it supports the silks and satins. Most of the time I use a matching color of cotton and I always wash the whole bolt in warm water first. I do a lot of ironing, but I like to iron. :-) I refold, inside out and roll the bolt up on cardboards as I iron and I get the cardboards from Walmart or fabric stores that throw them out. That way the cotton is all ready to go when I start pinning the patterns to it.

[Madame Olive Yew]

I have another one.....

How do you make a stand-up collar like this dress ??


:ty in advance!

[Lazy K]

I have another one.....

How do you make a stand-up collar like this dress ??


:ty in advance!

In my experience those little tiny pleats tend to stay "stiff" so they stand on their own.

[Madame Olive Yew]

How would one go about making a pattern for that kind of collar? I dont have anything that would come close, how do you draw one up to allow for all the tiny pleats? How do you get tiny pleats without a crimping machine?


:ty

[Lazy K]

Here's a pic of my red polka dot.

In my case, the pleat is even all the way across. I decided how wide I wanted the pleat, doubled that because I folded the fabric in half to have a finished edge. Then you pleat it just like anything else. These are about 1/4" pleats. VERY easy if you are using small striped material. You just fold and press every stripe or every other stripe

In the Alma Pic it seems to be longer in the back. The easiest way to get this effect is to do the same thing as I just described but make the pleat as wide as you want the widest part, sew along the bottom of the pleat to keep it together,then I'd pin it to the dress where you want it and mark the pleat where you will attach it, sew along that line you just marked then trim off the excess and attach to dress. Does that make sense?

[Lazy K]

Where is that pesky pic? Oh, here it is.

[Prairie Wildflower]

:ty , ladies, for the info on parasols. Fannie, I bookmarked that site. And I wrote down the Butterick pattern# - I'll check it out on my next trip to Jo-Ann's.

[Madame Olive Yew]

Thank you Lazy K, Makes sense to me. I think I might try it soon.:ty :ty :ty

[Lady Fleur]

only issue with the butterick is it is a TRIMMING pattern only:tap But WE here know how to do it!

[Dixie McCan]

Butterick has some nerve!:tap

[Drusilla]

As Lazy K illustrated the pleats stay up by themselves. I make them doubled over, and then add pleated lace underneath for support and cleanliness, the laces take the brunt of skin oils and make ups and keep the fashion fabrics cleaner. That's why I make the lace collars and cuffs removable, so they can be cleaned separately.
Sorry I have not kept up for the last two days, I fell off a stool in my office while attempting to put some books on a high shelf and tore some tendons in my knee and have been unable to get to the computor. It's healing slowly with some ice and horse linaments....:-( and lots of asprin.

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

Oh Dru, you poor thing! You and Allie Mo are going to end up being on the same posse if you aren't careful...The Gimpy Alley Cat Posse. :rofl :rofl :rofl Just kidding! I hate that you have injured your knee, but hey, now you have an excuse to stay on the computer and not do housework.

Fannie (who figures you gotta look at everything in a positive light) Kikinshoot

[Drusilla]

Thanks Fannie, but being the very active person I am....it's really hard sitting still for long any time, injured or not. But my nurse friend told me to stay down for a week, and I must obey her orders, she is old, experienced, and carries a big wallop! So I am being good, so I can play/work later. I am catching up on my sleep, and books that I have been wanting to read. Allie is probably doing the same for a bit too.
Any more Historically Accurate Costuming questions anyone???

[Lady Leigh]

Question on stockings ... different styles and colors, and what ever else anyone thinks about.

[Allie Mo]

Oh my gosh Dru!

Not you too! I hope you feel better soon!

Your pardner in pain,

[Drusilla]

"The history of stockings started in 1589 when a Reverend William Lee invented the knitting machine. Stockings were made of silk, cotton and wool and they were referred to as "hose" from which the term hosiery was derived and were generally worn by men on the outside (showing) and sometimes by women, (not showing)."
In the 1800'ds many hose/stockings were embroidered, or embellished on the sides, you can occasionally find these on ebay (antique). For colder weather I personally prefer cotton and silk and the horizonatal striped varieties are period correct to the late 1880's and early 1890's. Dancers wore the vertically striped versions to show off while dancing, we have seen some period photos of these here on the CB site. In the 1880's and beyond, stockings were held up with garters suspended from the bottom of the corset.

Thanks Allie, I completely empathise with you! It's ugly, it hurts, and it's no fun now, but we can kick up our heels later when we heal up.;-) I think I will buy RED stockings and show off my legs when I am done getting better! And no more falling down that is NOT choreographed for US!!

[Madame Olive Yew]

Ohh Gosh, Poor Dru!! Get better soon!!!


Other than the types of trim Heather at TV recomends on the last page of all her patterns, is there any other PC trim that one can make with fabric?

Does any one have any ribbon folding techniques? (Sp?) Lazy K did the wonderful class on prairie points, anything else that's cool?


:ty

[Drusilla]

Thanks dear, seems I am a tiny bit accident prone/read VERY ACTIVE.VBG!
Oh boy what a subject, well, you must look on www.amazonbooks.com, there are many books devoted to the subject of manipuating ribbons and fabric, and that alone is quite an art. Just think like oragami in fabric. There are ladies that devote thier whole lives to learning how to turn ribbon and fabrics into art forms to embellish many types of textiles. Here are a few books.

"The Artful Ribbon" by Candace Kling
"The Art of Manipulating Fabric" by Colette Wolff
"Fine Embellishment Techniques" by Jane Conlon

[Sherry B]

Of all the ribbon books that I have sifted through i find that "The Artful Ribbon" by Candace Kling is the best. She has a great formula for ribbon lengths. Many of the books give wonderful instructions to make things but they will say you will need 3yds of 1.5" ribbon, but if you want to make it larger or smaller you have to guess at the ribbon length. all of her projects start out with a formula for ribbon width that will calculate the length of ribbon needed.

[Allie Mo]

I have a trim technique. I haven't used it yet and can't find a photo.

You make box pleats out of ribbon. I think I saw it in 1-inch gros grain. Then, sew down the middle, lengthwise (instead of one edge).

I've never done it; but, it sounds easy and looks nice.

Does someone out there have a :ss ?

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

I know we talked about this earlier in the thread, but I found more photos of my dust ruffle...I knew I had them, just couldn't remember where I saved them. :re
These show the buttons and the ties that hold on the dust ruffle.

[Drusilla]

Thanks Fannie!!:ty

[Chantilly]

Dru & Sherry B - Thanks so much for the info regarding "The Artful Ribbon". I just received the book - oh wow!!

Thanks again!

[Lazy K]

btt:bump :bump :bump :bump

[Lady LaSalle]

Time to bump this thread back up to the top................Wisconsin dress coming soon!:tban :tban :tban

[Lazy K]

:waiting :waiting :tap :waiting

[Drusilla]

What's a Wisconsin Dress?

[Lazy K]

She talking about a pattern from the Wisconsin Historial Society: Patterns of History

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

ummm its the discontined 1874?? or 76 bustle dress they used to have, Beth found it on Ebay and I sized it up for her. the pattern was a size 10 and well lets just say that with almost no modification Emily can wear the bodice so I dont know that I agree its a 10 as we know it.

I probably dont size up the way other people do. I basically take her size in a TV pattern (because I know that will fit well) and redraft the entire shape using the TV length width and overall size for each pattern piece. I am sure there is a correct mathmatical way to do it, but I have not taken a flat pattern drafting class (yet)

I am trying to rememebr what fabric she is going to use for this one...there are so many one gets confused:gg

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

I also use a national garment cutter square and curve and draft that way too, I have found it to be nicely accurate. (I mention that because I think I did that with this pattern...and the TV thing with the scottish polinaise) now that I think about it.

[Madame Olive Yew]

What would Lady LaSalle (heck all of us) do with out Gypsy? She is too good to be true!:tban

Cant wait to see the wisconsin dress!

[Ida Hands]

I also use a national garment cutter square and curve and draft that way too, I have found it to be nicely accurate. (I mention that because I think I did that with this pattern...and the TV thing with the scottish polinaise) now that I think about it.

But, (and I am being jealous here) how many of us have access to the National Garment Cutter square and curve?

[Lady LaSalle]

But, (and I am being jealous here) how many of us have access to the National Garment Cutter square and curve?



Honey, I didn't get my title as the Queen of Acquistions for nothing!!!! That was an eBay find that when I told Josie about it she almost jumped thru the phone to make my hands type faster on the keyboard to place a bid! Got the whole tool set and pattern book for under $20. I so totally rock!:rofl

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

no that wasent the part that makes her rock...it was the part where she sent it to me to use!!

Unfortunatly, it came with the heavy srings of drafting stuff for her higness of the full closet. I am still not EVER giving it back..not ever...ummmnope!

Greeneyed (I have drafted a skirt foe me, and a top dress for emily...both worked. ) Gypsy

PS you can get a freanch curve and square for pattern drafting from Richard the thread, and Lacis ect. But I have no idea how you work them. The national Garment cutter came with directions, and we have aquired four books of various years for it and its scaled by bust measure. If I make it back to OK there is a flat pattern drafting class in theater costuming at the college hopefully this will be something I can learn more about as life goes on. Drafting and construction fascinate me.

[Lady Leigh]

National Garment Cutter square and curve!

I want one, I want one, I want one ...... Ok Aquisition Queen, start aquisitioning!!! (the directions, too!) Please???????????????????

[Cinnamon Teal]

If I make it back to OK there is a flat pattern drafting class in theater costuming at the college hopefully this will be something I can learn more about as life goes on. Drafting and construction fascinate me.
You would have fun taking that class. I took one here in Sacramento a few years ago and it really was interesting and has helped with adjusting patterns for folks that just don't fit the norm..... which is most of the people I sew for.:lool

While taking these classes, I bought a kit of pattern making tools. It came in it's own portfolio. If I remember correctly, it was called a Dargate kit. I got it for half-price because I was enrolled in the classes. Very cool tools.

[Lady LaSalle]

National Garment Cutter square and curve!

I want one, I want one, I want one ...... Ok Aquisition Queen, start aquisitioning!!! (the directions, too!) Please???????????????????



Hmmmm..................possibly. How much is it worth to you? GG is in debt for life to me! LMAO!!!!:lool :lool :lool

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

HOLD UP?!?! Who said I would rent her out to you?!?!?

Greeneyed (Huh?!?!) Gypsy

PS...Diane you have a phone call comming in. I think she found something for you.

[Lady LaSalle]

HOLD UP?!?! Who said I would rent her out to you?!?!?

Greeneyed (Huh?!?!) Gypsy

PS...Diane you have a phone call comming in. I think she found something for you.

Have no fear, darling. Remember that little number I found last week that we were talking about having husband replicate? Ok, well I just found 2 more!:lool :lool :lool

[Lady LaSalle]

It has begun! My skirt is finished except for hemming and trimming. The hemming won't take long, the trimming will! I may have it done tomorrow, but we shall see. So here is my heavy drapery weight fabric ready for the cutting. See ma, no pins!

[Lady LaSalle]

This skirt didn't take me as long to do as some of my others because it is NOT LINED. I did this intentionally because the fabric is so stinkin' HEAVY! So instead, I will wear two petticoats underneath as demonstrated here on my dummy. This is the front.

[Lady LaSalle]

This is the TV 201 skirt. I didn't put the pocket in the side seam because there will be an overskirt with this outfit. And the overskirt will, more than likely, have a parasol pocket on it instead. This is the side view.

[Lady LaSalle]

And lastly the back view. As you can all see, I have it buttoning in the back. The pattern calls for a side closure, but I don't like that. So instead, I split the fabric down at the fold about 8 inches then covered the raw edge with bias tape. I am using wooden buttons on the skirt closure.



And, oh yeah-------total sewing time from cutting to on the dress form was 4 hours. :sewing

[Lady LaSalle]

The skirt is hemmed, and it is time to add the ruffle. Pictures shortly.:tban

[Drusilla]

Beautiful! Love the color. Sometimes I do the closure in the rear too.

[Lazy K]

And the overskirt will, more than likely, have a parasol pocket on it instead. This is the side view.

OK, I'm clueless. What's a parasol pocket??

[Victoria Rose Hyde]

Oh Lady LaSalle: I love the fabric you are using. Can't wait to see more!!

[Lady LaSalle]

OK, I'm clueless. What's a parasol pocket??


It's not the greatest picture..........I know Fannie has better ones. But here is a parasol pocket.

[Lady LaSalle]

Ok, this is what I'm doing to my ruffle...........I'm making it with a scalloped edge. Here is how:

Step #1: Have your head examined. It's too late for me.

Step #2: Take a piece of cardboard or heavy stock, and use the long edge to make your template. Decide on how big of a scallop your want then find something that size and trace it. For example: For a micro scallop, a popcicle stick would work best. I'm going for a small scallop, so I'm using the top lip of a medicine cup. I used the lens portion of a Maglite flashlight to make the scallop pattern for Fannie's Aurora Borialis skirt. Trace 1/2 of your object, move it over to wear the next scallop should begin and repeat until you're almost at the end of the cardboard. DO NOT GO TO THE END! You'll see why in the next steps. Cut it out.

[Lady LaSalle]

Press your fabric and fold it in half. Starting on the folded edge, place the rounded edge of your template on the fold and close to the bottom. Trace the template. When you get down to the last scallop on your template, stop----move the template over and continue until you get to the end of your fabrice strip. You should reach the end of the fabric along with the end of your template. This is your seam allowance for sewing the next ruffle on. The top picture shows starting on the folded fabric with your template, and the bottom shows ending on the edge with a seam allowance.

[Lady LaSalle]

Now carefully cut out your scallops. A small sharp pair of scissors works really well for this. LEAVE YOUR FABRIC FOLDED IN HALF WHEN YOUR CUTTING. So be careful. Make sure the edges of your fabric meet. It helps if you make all of the cuts in one direction, then make the rest of the cuts in the other. Sounds weird, but it's true.

[Lady LaSalle]

There! All finished cutting!

[Lady LaSalle]

Now if you're like me and completely insane, you can scallop the top half of the ruffle, too!

[Lady LaSalle]

Ladies of the day would either leave the raw edge of the scallop alone or they would hand stitch the edge. I'm not doing either. Fray check was made for lazy persons such as myself and I don't want all of their efforts and years of chemical engineering to go to waste. ALWAYS CHECK TO SEE IF FRAY CHECK WILL DISCOLOR YOUR FABRIC!!! I learned this the hard way when I did Fannie's skirt. I recut the scalloped ruffle on her skirt at least twice!:faint

Total time to make one ruffle: 45-60 minutes

[Clancy]

LL the colours of that skirt are just beautiful, and they will suit just right!


Thanks for the scalloping How To Do, looks quite simple.... Im not sure i could leave them with a raw edge, i would need to make two layers and sandwich them then turn them right way out... But i must admitt yours came our very nice... Does fray check wash out in water?

[Lady LaSalle]

It says permanent on the bottle, so I hope it is! GG says she zig-zags her scallop edge first then cuts it out. My machine has zig-zag issues----it really mucks it up----so that's why I cut mine out and then fraycheck it.

[Madame Olive Yew]

WOW:faint You really have lost your mind!

Thank you for the How-to, but I dont know how I would feel about leaving the edge raw either. I definatly dont think I want to attemp making two & turning them right side out. Might try the zig-zag sometime on a small piece......

[Lazy K]

I don't like raw edges either but Historically, trims were sometimes left with the raw edge. You wouldn't want to use a fabric that ravel easily (unless of course that's the look you are going for)

[Lady LaSalle]

Ok ladies, the skirt is finished! I also put on a single row of very narrow soutache-like trim 2 inches below the scalloped top edge right at the gather. You see I have this OCD thing with matchy-matchy. There will be brussels lace on the bodice, so I must have something else in the same ivory color also on the skirt. And right now, I couldn't come up with the $600+ for the piece of lace that would have fit! Besides that, I'd have a heart attack if I ripped it while shooting!:faint


Total adding trim to skirt time: approx. 6 hours (took a break to eat dinner and watch Ghost Rider!:rofl )

[Iron Ed]

It's not the greatest picture..........I know Fannie has better ones. But here is a parasol pocket.
Looks like a saddle scabbard for a rifle! :) :re :)

[Drusilla]

What a novel idea Iron Ed! Imagine their surprise when I whip out that lever action .45 from under my overskirt and kill all the cowboys even before the Earps are halfway down the steet!!!:rofl :rofl :rofl (blanks of course!)

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

What a novel idea Iron Ed! Imagine their surprise when I whip out that lever action .45 from under my overskirt and kill all the cowboys even before the Earps are halfway down the steet!!!:rofl :rofl :rofl (blanks of course!)

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl

[Lady Leigh]

LL isn't nearly as deranged as the gal who made this one!!!

LL!! You are doing great!!! So far I really really like what you have done!

[Chantilly]

LL - That is beautiful! I love those scalloped edges and the fray check tip. Have you used the fray check when making pleats?? I'm loving the "no sew" for heming trim!!!! I might actually do more of it if I could skip that hem part!

[Drusilla]

Fray Check is great, but it does not last forever. If you dry clean or wash the clothing a bit the fray check can wear off. I like to use it on the ends of grograin to prevent fraying.

[Lady LaSalle]

SCALLOPED RUFFLES MUST DIE!!!:blast Whose idea was that anyhow? Oh yeah, it was MINE!:bhd These things are like Tribbles-----they keep multiplying cause I keep needing more! *GROAN* I may get this overskirt done sometime this century. Now someone tell me why I wanted to do a historically accurate dress? :hmr :ug Drusilla, I don't know how you do it!

[Lazy K]

I put scallops on my overskirt for my polka dot dress. They are not ruffled and they're larger so there's not too many. But I hand bound them with bias type! It seemed like a good idea at the time:faint

I won't be doing anymore scallops for a while

[Lady LaSalle]

Ok, gonna try this once more. I've been trying to post here for the last 15 minutes, but have been unsuccessful at posting the pictures. To say the least, I am in love with the overskirt pattern! It's fabulous! I love the way that it bustles in the back and the way that it goes together! I've included pictures of how it bustles for you gals as well. I didn't have any shoe laces or twill tape, so I used gros grain ribbon which was available back in the day. The gros grain ribbon is also a bit heavier and supports the weight of the skirt nicely as you can see in the pictures. Now I know I have that tied back to the max, but it just looks so pretty that way! My dummy was feeling a bit underdressed so I draped the brussles lace lappet and the necklace on her. Did I mention that I love this overskirt? And yes, the scalloped ruffles must die, but darn if they don't look good when theyr'e all done!

[Allie Mo]

WOW! WOW! WOW!

:bow I love it!

:waiting :tap Where's the bodice? :lool

[Drusilla]

How do I do it?? I'm absolutely insane, that's how....I'm CRAZZZZZYYY!!!!:rofl :rofl :rofl
No honestly, Arlene will tell you the same thing, years and years of study, voraciously devouring ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING VICTORIAN...in fact there is SO much to study you just have to pick a particular area of interest and make it your all consuming obsession.:faint

[Lady LaSalle]

The mock is done only after some technical difficulties last night that required a midnight consultation with GG to help me fix. We are packing up today getting ready for our camping trip, so I don't know how much I'll get done today. I'm anxious to get it done!:tban

So Dru, how am I doing? Besides the fraycheck, am I still being a good girl and playing by the rules? LMAO!!!!

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

I think we got the kinks worked out, this bodice has two foldy pleaty thingies that sit one on top of the other and you face each piece first then pleat then hand tack up inside....well that was just three required steps too many...you mean I cant serge it?!?!!? :gg

Seriously though she is doing such an amazing job, watching LLs Dressmaking develop over the last couple years has been something to see. The only thing she really sewed before this (this being victorian) were hospital scrubs...now look at her!

Greeneyed (nope I am not even remotely proud of her at all)Gypsy

[Accurate Allie]

It's coming along great LL!!!! I can't wait to see the top, especially with that beautiful lace collar!!!

I have actually used FreyBlock instead of FreyCheck when doing trim like that, and it worked a little better for me. It dosen't show at all (FreyCheck sometimes will dry shinny and is really visible) and it also is flexible when it dries. FreyBlock comes in a green and purple tube and you can find it at most fabric stores.

[Lady LaSalle]

The mock was done last night, and I had time this evening to start the bodice. The sleeves are not sewn in yet, the cuffs of silk and brussels lace aren't done (but I pinned the lace on just to aggrevate GG :gg ), the silk vested insertion piece isn't cut out (but I draped the lappet on again just to aggrevate GG :gg ), the darts aren't sewn in, the boning channels are ready but the boning isn't in, the buttons are in a baggie, and the facing for the tails isn't sewn on. But other than that, it's done!:lool I purposefully left the facing off of the tails because it's hard to see the contrast and the folds with the red silk. And I had to get my hat down and see if it matched! Yup, it does! There will be no parasol pocket on the overskirt because my parasol is WAY too big even though it folds in half. But I think I will put a regular pocket on it to hold my hankie, lipstick, and other LL accessories! I have really debated on how to trim the bodice over the past 24 hours. And after a long and drawn out conversation with myself, I won. There will be no scalloped ruffles on the bodice (You can stop dancing now, GG). Instead, I will just add some of my soutache trim to the bottom hem of the bodice including the tails and the edge of the silk cuffs. I think that will be plenty, especially since I think that the ruffles would detract from the beautiful lace. So just a bit more work to be done, and it will be finished. It will have to wait, however, until later next week because we're heading off to go camping in the morning (that's what all of that gear is laying around my house). Hope you are as pleased with the progress of this dress as I am!

[Chantilly]

LL - what a beautiful gown! Your attention to detail is amazing! Elegant!! Nicely done!! Can't wait to see it on you!!

Have fun camping!

[Lady LaSalle]

This is the pocket that I want to do. It's from Peterson's 1876. I think it would work nicely. Instead of the bow, I'll either put a piece of my brussels lace or some of the soutache trim or both. The pocket will be out of the striped fabric with the bottom and top edges being the red scalloped silk taffeta. Yup........that's what I'm doing. I'm glad I had that conversation with myself and that I won!:lool

[Drusilla]

Very pretty, I love the hat, it's perfect!! You COULD put wide scalloping behind/underneath the white collar, just the edges of the scallops would frame the white nicely..just a thought to keep the decorating theme consistant.:w2

[Lazy K]

Oh wow! I was so busy looking at the overskirt that I didn't see the hat! Great overskirt, great hat. And I love those little add on pockets. That will look nice.

[Ida Hands]

Honey, I didn't get my title as the Queen of Acquistions for nothing!!!! That was an eBay find that when I told Josie about it she almost jumped thru the phone to make my hands type faster on the keyboard to place a bid! Got the whole tool set and pattern book for under $20. I so totally rock!:rofl

YOU BET YOU DO! :tban We have been saying that for ages! I have been looking for one (A National Diamond Garment Cutter) for a long time with no success. I'm hoping to get hit with the "Lady LaSalle Aquisition Bug" soon! I am in total awe of your talent! Your creations are STUNNING! Love EVERYTHING ABOUT THIS ONE!

[Madame Olive Yew]

Ohh Lady LaSalle, I love it!! I still think you are crazy, but that is why we love you! LL will attempt what all else wont think about, & for her it turns out BEAUTIFULLY!!!:tban :tban

You are gonna look so good in this one!:tban :tban :tban

[Prairie Wildflower]

WOW!! I fall more in love with this outfit with each photo you post. The fabric is TDF-gorgeous (covet, covet, covet). And I've loved that hat since I first saw your photos of it on Denise Nadine's website. That lace - drool-worthy indeed!! This is one absolutely stunning outfit - you should be very proud of your accomplishment.

[Allie Mo]

LL,

It is, as usual, one of your beautiful and original creations!

Okay now :waiting for an :ss of it on you! :lool

[Boss Lady]

Beautiful gown, LL! And the hat goes perfectly with it. What a great job you have done. Thanks for sharing the photo's.

[Lady LaSalle]

Unfortunately, I had time to think more about this dress while I was on vacation. Me, myself, and I had another conversation last night after I read Dru's post. I went back and looked at the 1876 CD, and I have to put ruffles somewhere on the bodice. I think I know what I want to do. We shall see before the day is out. Maybe pictures today.

[Lady LaSalle]

Ok, I think I'm back on track again. I am happy with the results and they don't look too over the top. So this is how I started off today by putting on the front red silk taffeta placket and the ruffles around the bottom and the swallow tail pleats in the back.

[Lady LaSalle]

My dilemma of the day was how to put ruffles somewhere up on the top. My initial thought was perhaps a fake front with row after row of ruffles. But I was afraid that the effect would look like fish scales----not what I want! So then I thought about a standing collar. I tried it, and it looked too Elizabethean. So instead, I just trimmed the entire neckline with a tappered scalloped ruffle----narrow in the front and wider in the back. I like this alot. Then I just added the soutache braid. I draped the lace on again, and I am really happy with how it looks. The lace doesn't get lost, which is what I want.

[Madame Olive Yew]

So glad you solved he dilema. It is looking fabulous!! Keep :sewing !!

[Lady LaSalle]

This is the sleeve pattern that I'm using as my stepping stone. It's also from 1876.

[Lady Leigh]

I wasn't 100% sure I would like the ruffles around the bodice pleats when we were visiting last night .... but now that I see the picture, I like them alot! I really like how the braid helped to set it off!

The one thing I love is the lace you are using on the bodice!!! Goodness, but that is soooooo beautiful!!!

(I can't get over how conservative this gown is:rofl )

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

(I can't get over how conservative this gown is:rofl )

I agree! Are you making this for someone else?:lool :lool

It really is looking great. I love the lace, too! You go girl!

[Victoria Rose Hyde]

Me To :tban Me Too :tban I was just going to say I love that lace on the bodice when Lady L and Fannie beat me to it. It really does set it off nicely.

[Lady LaSalle]

Believe me, this is NOT an easy thing for me to do. Frankly, it's killing me. But have no fear. My next dress is my Merry Widow outfit and there ain't NOTHING conservative about that sucker!:rofl Shoot, I have everything out and ready to go to start it tonight if I get this dress done!:lool

The lace is a brussels lace lappet----the real deal. I think I got it either off of eBay or the antique lace site for about $20. I thought it was a good deal. I am really happy with it.


Speaking of lace-------GG, you'll be happy to know that I only had to cut one piece of the brussels lace trim so far for the cuffs of the dress. I still have one piece left, and I think I'll put it on the pocket. So I think I did pretty good, this coming from the woman who wanted to cut an antique needle lace scarf in half to make trim!:lool

[Lady LaSalle]

I was up very late last night, and managed to get both sleeves done! I'm thrilled with them! I had to pin the buttons on last night because I couldn't stand it any longer----I had to see what they looked liked! LOL!!! Then I had to see what the hat looked liked, too, so I taped GG's wig head with the wig on the dummy's neck. Looks like she is suffering from giraffe-itis, but it gives you a good idea of what the whole thing is going to look like. So while taking pictures just now to post for you all, I decided to go get that piece of lace trim that I was going to put on the pocket and cover up the taped neck. I think I may have discovered a new use for the lace!:faint I love it!!!! It shall be there permanently before the day is out!:sewing Things left to do on this dress:
1. Do the darts
2. Do the button holes
3. Sew on the buttons (19 of them)
4. Secure the double swallow tail on the bodice
5. Construct the pocket
6. Add the lace to the neckline
7. Add the lace lappet

p.s. That is Casey in the back ground. She says "hi"!

[Lady LaSalle]

Things left to do on this dress:
1. Do the darts----DONE
2. Do the button holes----DONE
3. Sew on the buttons (19 of them)----DONE
4. Secure the double swallow tail on the bodice----DONE
5. Construct the pocket----DONE
6. Add the lace to the neckline
7. Add the lace lappet





I am hand sewing the lace on now! It will be done today! Pictures later on!

[Lady Leigh]

My!! What a loooooong neck you have!!! Ms. Albino looks stunning in her new gown!!! Though I can't help but think it would look better on someone with a tad more color!:rofl

Beth!! It is such a BEAUTIFUL gown!!! I know you are happy with it, too, but just listen to all of the other wonderful and flattering comments! Well done!! Kudos!!!!!!

[Lady LaSalle]

It's done!!!!!!!!!:tban :tban :tban

So here is the pocket that I made. It was very simple to do. I sewed on the gathered scalloped ruffle first on the top edge, then gathered the entire top edge. Next I sewed on the soutache trim. Then I pleated the bottom ruffle and sewed it onto the bottom of the pocket on the inside seam. Then I pinned the pocket on the overskirt and sewed it on. Then I sewed the soutache trim on the bottom. I did it this way so that the bottom edge of the pocket had two rows of stitching to help prevent any tearing for all of the weight that will be in there!:rofl

[Lady LaSalle]

Here is the inside of the bodice. The seams are not pressed open for a reason----they are my boning channels! PMS along with several other folks do this, and it works well. Ladies back in the day did this too (there have been pictures posted showing this previously), so I'm still accurate---phew! You can see the piece of gros grain ribbon I used to secure the double swallow tail pleat. You will also notice that my darts are not cut. This allows for room to grow or shrink-----much easier to alter if need be in the future. You can also see my "fish dart"! It is a small dart, about 2-3" long and about 3/4" wide that goes about 1" below the waist line horizontally. This little dart smoothes out the wrinkles at the front/side pieces.

[Lady LaSalle]

Here is my lace! Yup, I hand sewed it and the lappet on the bodice. UGH! I hate hand sewing!

[Lady LaSalle]

...........I hate hand sewing, but the results are wonderful!!!!!!!!!!! My husband and my girls are stunned. They both say it's the prettiest dress that I have ever made. So for a historical dress, I think I did pretty good! I didn't break too many rules, except for the fray check, and I am super pleased with the results! I hope that you all have enjoyed this thread, and that you use the information for your future projects!

Thank you all for your kind words and encouragement along the way on this unique journey of mine!

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

Okay, I am totally impressed!!! This dress is beautiful and you look so...ummmm.....respectable! :rofl :rofl :rofl
Seriously, you did a fabulous job! Back to the sewing room for me, I'm working on my bodice so I can post photos of my new outfit.:go

[Lizzie Marie]

Looks wonderful and like Fannie I am so amazed it is sooooo respectable :tban :lool

[Lazy K]

Very Pretty!

[Lady LaSalle]

.........and you look so...ummmm.....respectable! :rofl :rofl :rofl


Yeah, well at least we all know better!:lool

[Allie Mo]

Hey, guess what?

The word "respectable" wasn't the first thing that popped into my head. :lalala

I thought, "how elegant." :gg

It looks fantastic on you LL! Kudos again! :tban