Taking the Measure

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

I have been meaning to do this for my site for some time. I am going to post in both modern clothing and in victorian undies so you can see the contrast.

I also want to share a few words from some of our many antique publications that have been calling LL's and my name latey to get burned to CD...its such an overwheling job!

Ok lets start with the waist. I like to do the tie a string method as well. You tie a string (or piece of elastic) around your waist, it should settle into the smallest place you can check by bending sideways the string should be in the crease (ok I need to strech more I cant bend! Sheesh!)

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

This is an AD from the Delineator from August 1889
It says

" In taking measures, it is immaterial whether the patry taking then stands before or behind the party being measured. If properly observed, the following rules for measuring will insure satisfactory results."

To measure for a Lady's Bodice or any garment requiring a Bust Measure to be taken. Put the measure around the body OVER the dress, close under the arms, drawing it closely-not too tight.

To measure for a skirt or overskirt- put the measure around the waist, OVER the dress.

To measure for a lady's sleeve Put the measure around the muscular part of the upper arm, about an inch below the lower part of the arm's-eye, drawing the tape closely-not to tight.
Take measures for Misses and young ladies the same as or ladies. In ordering give ages also.

The rest is for boys and men.

OK and the image, don't you just love these old images?? The top right is an AD for purchasing tape measures

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Bust measure around the fullest part of the bust, now this sounds simple, BUT as I am sure you know if you have ever tried it, sometimes the bust is not on the same level as the widest part of the back up under the arms, basically you need to try and get a good "widest" measure so you dont end up with a tight bodice.

Notice I missed the fullest part of the bust a bit (thats the green line) Its best to have someone else do these for you, so I hope this helps all the Hubbies out there who we enlist in our mad sewing schemes.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Hip ohhhh the awful hip! This is pretty easy, just slide the tape over the hip where it pulls to the fullest thats your hip (wide as it may be!)

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Lets see For TV patterns Heather request is very tricky back width, which is SO important to a good fit. So I am going to try to demonstrate where I take this. Its a straight measure across the widest part of the back. Standing straight and easy (dont try to stand straighter than you normally do it will just result in a tight back that after a few hours in will not be comfortable)

Its from the arm crease to the arm crease straight across! See the green dots?

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Ok while we are lookin' at my backside, lets do length, This is where that string is going going to come in handy. You measure from the base of your neck, I have seen this described in Publications is the large bone in the spine at the bace of the neck, which I just happen to have so it not too dificult for me. Basically is should where the base of a collar seam sits on you. Stop at the nice handy waist string!

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

The measure that CT and EM were talking about is Hip length and it is a straight line from the waist string to the hip (you can tie another string as I did here to help you) This is useful in corset measure, and close fitting NF bodice at times.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Skirt length ... I like these in both the front and the back. You take this again from the nice little string around your waist, it makes a perfect anchor and starting point. You measure to the floor, with shoes on.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Opps missed the photos. Here is the back skirt length

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Oh look we are having a slight earthquake in CA...well no matter it seems to be subsiding now...here is the front, or not seems I deleted that one...OK so for front skirt you start at your Handy Dandy waist string and go straight to the floor with shoes on, pretty simple.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Arm Scyth .."What?" Arm Scyth...what you saw writted as the Arm's-eye in the AD above this is the difficult to write, easy to show Top of the shoulder around the arm pit to the top of the shoulder measure.
You should have your arm being measured down and close but not tight is very important here, sleeves have enough problems being tight without adding a too small measure, on the other hand if you need a smooth sleeve and measure too big here you are going to have a difficult time getting the sleeve cap to lay nice if you are trying to cram in a sleeve size that is a bit big.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Ok so thats it for the modern clothing. I will do them all again in corset as it does make a difference.
I think I got them all...I am looking for the book that had printed that a good garment could not be had with anything less than 22 measurments! Now arent you all glad we have Heather and Truly Victorian??

[Cinnamon Teal]

GG,

Great explanations of taking measurements. If I can find a copy of the measuring chart we used in my classes, I'll get your address from you and send you a copy. You may find it a bit helpful - I know I have. Also, if anyone else would like a copy of this chart, let me know and I'll get it to you.

One suggestion on the bust measurement that you did - there are actually three bust measurements - high bust (which is almost where you took the measurement); the regular bust measurement around the fullest part and under the bust. For modern measurements - the regular bust and under the bust will help most women figure the correct sizing for their bras. For that high bust measurement, if you took your tape up about two more inches than your picture, you'd be in the right spot.

[Cinnamon Teal]

I forgot to mention that if you have a friend that can help you take the measurements, it will be better. I know if I need measurements done, it's better if a friend does it..... hubbie gets distracted too easy.... :blush

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Ah yes thats correct...if you look at the antique image look closely at the bust this is what CT is talking about. Underbust (I thought I forgot one!) These are easier for me in corset (LOL) I will add those to the victorian undie photos (need to curl my hair and get pretty as I can I want them for my site as well) LOL

[Lady Fleur]

I have also used the tip to tip (breast tips) measurement.. Good for lining up the darts under the bust...

[Cinnamon Teal]

One more bust point measurement that I remembered when Fleur mentioned hers is to actually measure from the shoulder to the bust point. This is especially important if you pattern has a dart that goes from the side to the busy... although I don't think historical patterns should have that dart. Can't remember when that dart became popular.

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

GG, thanks so much.

Everyone, these measurements are so important to a properly fitting dress. If you are trying to cut out a generic "A" or "B" size for your TV bodice, you will be sorely disappointed. Let me explain this way. When I first started this, I was clueless, so I cut out a generic size C....bodice did not fit well at all. When I use my measurements as described here, and apply those to the formula that Heather gives in the TV patterns, I usually (depending on pattern) cut out a size "E" for the front and size "A" for the back....yes size "A" for the back. My bust measures 36 inches with my corset on, but my back is only 11 inches across. Then after a cut out the size E for the front, I have to dart the heck out of the waist, but boy do my bodices fit so nicely now.

[Fannie Kikinshoot]

P.S. Don't forget to cut your armholes correctly. I cut out a size C armhole. So on my size E front and size A back, I make sure that I cut out a C at the armhole.....an armhole that is too small and rubs, is miserable.

[Cinnamon Teal]

I found the measuring chart I mentioned in a previous note. If anyone is interested in receiving a copy, PM me or send your address to me at geriroyer@aol.com
(geriroyer@aol.com)

[Jolene]

Thank you that was great i ordered some patterns from TV last year and have just been looking at them pondering the whole measurement thing. So this was a great help thanks alot
Jolene

[Ida Hands]

I have been meaning to do this for my site for some time. I am going to post in both modern clothing and in victorian undies so you can see the contrast.

Miss Gypsy:
Will you be posting this information in Victorian undies? I am SO interested in the difference. I know you showed the difference it makes wearing a lovely outfit WITH and WITHOUT a corset and this was such a drastic difference. Thank you, Miss Gypsy, for sharing your knowledge with us.

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

Yes you know I got so busy, I will do this though.
It wont be this week, I need to work with a neighbor for this and she is sick and I dont have a digital camera ( again) thanks to Jack (sigh)

Lets see Ima and I keep trying to find two days we are not both flat busy to get todether and do some dummie/fitting/ scheming for future dresses....

If I can manage to get to Ima's on Monday we will get this done!

[Ida Hands]

No rush. I was just curious. You give such good information, I didn't want to miss it! :ty

[Lazy K]

btt.......

[Ida Hands]

Thank you, Lazy K! I was just having some difficulty about TV patterns and this is JUST THE TICKET! :tban:chick:tban :ty :ty

[Greeneyed Gypsy]

You know every time I see a post where I said I cant do this or that right now because of this or that? I am so glad I am retiring!

Still want to see a dress with modern undies and with victorian undies?

[Allie Mo]

Wonderful information GG!

:ty :ty :ty

[Prairie Wildflower]

:ty so much, GG and Fannie, for the advice and photos on measuring. I'm using the TV patterns for both my daughter and myself, and at times it can get a little confusing, because she is heavier and taller than Mom, so that means a lot of tracing the patterns onto Pattern Saver (love that stuff - :ty Fannie for recommending it in another thread) and using two entirely different sizes to do outfits for each of us. Guess what - in our schooling lessons this coming year, Mom is teaching her how do make her own outfits - doing two different outfits in two different sizes simultaneously is getting kinda old!!

Again, thanks so much, GG.

[Lazy K]

:help There is another measure that you left out and I can NEVER get it right. That's the side measure, from the waist to the arm hole. For some bizarre reason I ALWAYS have to cut the armhole lower . It always works out ok but why can't I get the correct measure? Anybody got any clues what I'm doing wrong and exactly where I should be measuring?

[Drusilla]

It's supposed to be that way, it's not something that can be a "fixed" measurement. Everyone should be scooping out the bottom front of the armskeye (armhole) in the bodice to make sure the front is smooth and that they have enough room to move comfortably, and of course the upper arm is different for every body. Also the adjustment for the smooth fit of the top of the bodice requires that the top front sections are moved upward and adjusted for chest fit, so in keeping with this the armskye is also cut and scooped out in the front bottom towards the armpit.

[Lazy K]

Oh, Ok. I hate fiddling with the armscyth. But if I must, I must.

[Drusilla]

Sorry some things are made to be fiddled with, human body measurement variables. The good thing is after you do about a dozen for yourself you pretty much know how much to fiddle.:lool

[Lazy K]

yeah, it seems that I use the same patterns each time but each bodice fits differently. I blame it on the garden gnomes. :rofl

[Nellie Blue]

And you wonder why I HATE :sewing :lalala :lalala :lalala :gg